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 N+1 bike - SWB Hi-Racer

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T O P I C    R E V I E W
ShelGame Posted - 01/28/2017 : 07:32:54
With the LWB bike basically done after having it's maiden flight, it's time to start on the n+1 bike. I'm starting with this:



I picked this frame up from Warren last summer with the intention of making a bike for my sons (ages 10 and 13).

It's going to get 24" BMX wheels and tires; a seat from Thor, and several left over parts from the LWB build. And some new parts, too. Hopefully we can get this done in time for Waterford this year. But you know how that goes.

The big change is going to be the rear dropouts. The wheelbase is too short, and the HT angle is too steep at about 77 deg (IMO). So, I want to lower the rear of the frame. I think if I move the dropouts to the rear of the triangle from the bottom, that will extend the WB an inch and a half or so and lower the rear maybe an inch.

I also want disk brakes. So, I'm planning to make new dropouts with some aluminum stock I have left over from the old prone frame.

So, I'm now making measurements to digitize the frame layout in CAD so I can get the geometry of the new dropouts correct.
25   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
ShelGame Posted - 10/08/2017 : 17:44:23
So, I think Iím giving up on modifying this frame. I actually like the bike as-is, and my older son can almost ride it. Just need to move the boom back a couple of inches.

So instead, Iím going to build a 24Ē stick bike for my younger son. I have most of the material and parts necessary. Hereís a first draft.

Making it big enough to later take 559ís.


ShelGame Posted - 08/13/2017 : 16:56:15
Ditched the chain tube setup and adapted a pair of POC nylon idlers. Makes a little more noise, but is noticebalely faster than the tubes...



ShelGame Posted - 08/01/2017 : 06:05:56
Any ideas why this bike should be smoother over rough pavement than my LWB bike? It's got 23mm tires, I'm running them at 80psi for now. Which is what I run in the LWB bike. I would have expected this bike, with a short 38" wheelbase, to be pitchy over bumps. But, It's actually noticeably smoother than the LWB bike. Maybe it's just the difference in weight distribution? Big front wheel makes that much difference (even lightly loaded)?
ShelGame Posted - 07/30/2017 : 19:16:18
My mom is visiting from Texas this week; she brought the bike I bought fro mJerry up with her. I gave it a quick ride around the block tonight (after putting some air in the tires). It actually rides quite nice; and it was very easy to start. The BB feels a little low to me, but that's probably just in comparison to my LWB bike. I did not like riding it over gravel, however. It definitely feels squirrely over gravel. Also, the front wheel is a little out of true and rubs a brake pad. My 10year old is way too short to ride this with the 26's on it. Maybe my 14 year old could reach the ground. Anyway, thanks Jerry for a really great deal...
Speedbiker Posted - 06/29/2017 : 19:24:23
How tall is the young man? FB message me, please.
ShelGame Posted - 06/29/2017 : 18:12:05
Moved the seat up to 35deg tonight and the 10year old can now touch the ground on this bike. With his tiptoes. Now to start cutting the new rear dropouts.

Anyone know a good aluminum welder in Michigan? I'm going to call Assenmachers to see if he does aluminum, but I suspect he only does steel.
Jerry Posted - 06/29/2017 : 16:40:18
i know what you mean about building your own wheels. I bought this DVD https://www.amazon.com/Master-Wheelbuilding-Bill-Mould/dp/B004H1UA9Y and truing stand 6 years ago and would take my wheels apart to just rebuild them. Now I don't even check to see if they are true unless something is rubbing! I thought when I retired I would have so much more free time. Man was I wrong.
ShelGame Posted - 06/29/2017 : 14:30:37
I have 2 451 22mm deep rims. Just need hubs for them. I've come to love lacing and truing wheels. It's just that the wheels I've already built for this are sooo pretty...
Jerry Posted - 06/29/2017 : 13:07:50
I would go with either a 451 or 406 wheel. My Musashi has a 451 front wheel, while the Baron has a 406. Larger wheels are not faster, they just don't fall into potholes as easily! I have been thinking about building delta trikes for my two grandson's. That way I don't have to worry so much about them falling over. Ha.
ShelGame Posted - 06/29/2017 : 07:31:39
After Waterford, my 10 year old is itching for a bike to ride in Northbrook. So, back to work on this thing.

I tried to have him sit on it; but with the seat at 25 deg, the bottom is just too high and his back too far down to make touching the ground possible.

I measured up the frame again to make sure my sketch was accurate. And, I looked for a shorter fork that would still give decent geometry - with no luck.

I think we'll have to raise the seat back up; with the side effect (due to the seat mounting on this frame) of lowering the seat bottom by about an inch. Both will help him to touch the ground while seated.

The next step, if that doesn't work, would be to go to 451's from these 520 rims. Maybe he'll grow a little bit before Northbrook...

Jerry Posted - 03/22/2017 : 19:57:57
I will be in the 65-69 year old bracket. I was going to race there this year, but surgery and getting sick, I wasn't in racing shape. I hope I can get in good enough shape to race somewhere this year. I would love to go to Waterford, but 1,300 miles is just too far one way.

Yeah, 50-60 degrees is a lot easier than the teens and lower temps with snow and ice.
ShelGame Posted - 03/22/2017 : 11:19:56
If the race at Texas Motor Speedway is an annual thing, that sounds like fun. I'd love to come down for that. I'm not quite old enough yet. (Been a while since I was able to say I wasn't old enough for something...).

I always miss living in north Texas, especially around January.
Jerry Posted - 03/22/2017 : 11:12:34
The original owner is on rbent. He added the head rest. When you come down, bring your bikes and we'll go for a ride.
ShelGame Posted - 03/22/2017 : 07:41:37
Well, thanks a bunch for delivering the bike to my mom's house. Now I have an excuse to visit. Or, to get her to come up north.

There was a very similar bike for sale on rbent a couple years ago. Is this that same bike? It seems to have the same headrest. Not sure if that's a standard part or not.
Jerry Posted - 03/22/2017 : 06:20:02
Ha, ha, no problem Rob. I was just waiting to see if anyone made the connection. The bubble face shield is working out great. I got stung 5 times last year by wasp, 3 times in the eye area, and twice on my cheek. All the nasty pollen and little white gnats don't get in my face now. I hope your son's enjoy the bikes. I know I did.
ShelGame Posted - 03/21/2017 : 12:15:03
quote:
Originally posted by ShelGame

They're multiplying. Just bought this bike from a seller near my mom's house in North Texas. Not sure how/when I'll get it home to Ann Arbor. But, now I'll have 2. Probably keep this one as-is, no mods. Then modify the frame from Warren and move the parts over from the 'original' when the modified frame is done...


http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/ExclusiveSeniorPhotography/media/IMG_0439.jpg.html



I just realized - did i buy this from Jerry here? I recognized the Giro helmet/visor pics in both of your threads here and there. If so, sorry, I didn't realize it was you over on BROL.
ShelGame Posted - 03/20/2017 : 08:37:32
quote:
Originally posted by Joel DIckman

Hello Shelgame - (Robert L.) -

I would like your Lightning crankset boom. I can't use the email on this board though, so please email me at my ordinary Hotmail email address:

joeldickman@hotmail.com

Thanks in advance, and safe riding,
Joel Dickman
http://lightningriders.com

These three prevent most accidents: seeing, being seen, & (usually) common sense.



e-mail sent...
Joel DIckman Posted - 03/20/2017 : 06:43:22
Hello Shelgame - (Robert L.) -

I would like your Lightning crankset boom. I can't use the email on this board though, so please email me at my ordinary Hotmail email address:

joeldickman@hotmail.com

Thanks in advance, and safe riding,
Joel Dickman
http://lightningriders.com

These three prevent most accidents: seeing, being seen, & (usually) common sense.
Balor Posted - 03/19/2017 : 12:17:03
Nearly a literal steal for 200$. :)
I wish there was a market in used bents in Russia, would make my job at creating my prototype MUCH easier with a "donor" at hand...
ShelGame Posted - 03/16/2017 : 07:28:02
They're multiplying. Just bought this bike from a seller near my mom's house in North Texas. Not sure how/when I'll get it home to Ann Arbor. But, now I'll have 2. Probably keep this one as-is, no mods. Then modify the frame from Warren and move the parts over from the 'original' when the modified frame is done...


http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/ExclusiveSeniorPhotography/media/IMG_0439.jpg.html
ShelGame Posted - 02/20/2017 : 17:37:21
Laced up the wheels this weekend. They're just laced, they still need to be trued. I ran out of patience.

I also mounted up the seat at 25 deg. I think that might be too low for my boys to learn on. So, I'm also going to put a 2nd set of mounting holes at 35 deg.

Balor Posted - 02/06/2017 : 13:37:53
Well, yea, as Foale's experiments with recumbent steering suggests (he also used boys as 'fresh test subjects' :)), OSS can be plenty intuitive so long as it is not tiller steering.
I think you might be better off with wide OSS right away, and than move to narrower setup.
Speedbiker Posted - 02/06/2017 : 13:28:39
I don't agree with your logic about learning, but I doesn't matter. Get it together and get those boys riding!
ShelGame Posted - 02/06/2017 : 10:14:58
quote:
Originally posted by Speedbiker

Don't forget a stop so the bars don't fall into your lap.

A word about USS: I hate how they look. I hate their terrible aerodynamics. But dang is it fun flying feet first with your arms down by your sides!



Yeah, I know they're not the best. But, my thinking is they might be easier to learn with. Want the boys to stay on the bike long enough to get used to riding it. Wide OSS bars will be the alternate if USS doesn't work.

Once they get used to riding and want to go faster, then we'll go to narrow OSS bars.
Speedbiker Posted - 02/06/2017 : 08:45:20
Don't forget a stop so the bars don't fall into your lap.

A word about USS: I hate how they look. I hate their terrible aerodynamics. But dang is it fun flying feet first with your arms down by your sides!

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