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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 04/04/2011 :  10:11:35  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hello Battle Mountain enthousiasts!

Since my graduation from the University some 12 years back, I wanted to build a streamliner but never had the resources. When I got involved with streamliners with Team Elan in 2008 my engineering hart was again jumpstarted and the wish to design and build a streamliner was infused.
When 1.5 years back I was contacted by a friend to help him to make his Vector faster my dream started to materialize. I was able to convince him to start from scratch and design and build an entirely new streamlinertrike.
When I was talking to Jan-Marcel and Hans Wessels about this there reaction was to combine these ideas; get all the people in Holland together that have experience or knowledge of fully faired streamliners and combine this knowledge and experience to design and build the fastest streamliner possible.
We started calling people up, and within a couple days, we had gathered 7 people that wanted to start a new project and invest and work hard to get a new streamliner designed and build before Battle Mountain 2011!
After a year of design, drawing, verification, and making a mock up we finalized the design. Just a couple weeks ago we had our molds CNC-milled to guarantee shape (read pressure distribution), and symmetry.
Now the molds are ready to do our first lay-up and build our first test fairing.

In order to cure the final fairings, we have to build our own oven.
These students have it easy

We will try to give you a regular update thru our website, but please be warned that our first priority is with building the actual bike!

Enjoy;

http://cygnus-hpv.nl/index-ENG.html

On behalve of Team Cygnus;

Thomas

Jeff Wills
human power supergeek

USA
1272 Posts

Posted - 04/04/2011 :  18:09:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I like how you rate your riders for "explosive force":
http://cygnus-hpv.nl/Team-ENG.html
You'll fit in just fine in Nevada.

Jeff

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Jeff Wills
All my bikes:
http://home.comcast.net/~jeff_wills/Gallery/index.html
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Victor Ragusila
recumbent enthusiast

Canada
402 Posts

Posted - 04/04/2011 :  19:06:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello Tomas

I wish you good luck with the new team, you guys will definitely kick ass!! The fairing shape looks really clean and fast, it will be a very pretty bike.

I was curious, looking at your bottom bracket, how far away are the bearings? We has a similar shell design, with the bearings very close together, and it was not very stiff. We are changing our design to get them a bit further from eachother. Q-factor of 78mm is really narrow.

Victor
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W Hilgenberg
recumbent enthusiast

USA
286 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  10:50:57  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Sounds like you will actually have to have a decent time in qualifying this year. . .
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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  11:48:34  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Victor Ragusila

Hello Tomas

I wish you good luck with the new team, you guys will definitely kick ass!! The fairing shape looks really clean and fast, it will be a very pretty bike.

I was curious, looking at your bottom bracket, how far away are the bearings? We has a similar shell design, with the bearings very close together, and it was not very stiff. We are changing our design to get them a bit further from eachother. Q-factor of 78mm is really narrow.

Victor



Hi Victor,

Thanks for your comment. I am not sure I understand you correctly, because the cranks are closer together the forces on the bearings increases but at the same time the moment reduces.
The BB in the pictures is Pieter Pas', and designed for him to use 180mm cranks in the fairing for his trike (yes that's right, we are building a trike, and two bicycles!). The BB bushing is 3mm thick, and the bearings are industrial oversized bearings. As long as the frame 40mm, 1mm thick steel for now, is stiff enough, it won't be a problem.

The bike is designed to fit Jan-Marcel, David Verbroekken and Jan van Steeg. hans and me will fit in the bike but have to have a canopy in order to fit. When we have the first fairing done you will see what I mean in the photo's.
Pieter will use the same fairing but will make a tricycle.

We might post some Solidworks pictures to show you how.

Thomas
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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  11:49:38  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by W Hilgenberg

Sounds like you will actually have to have a decent time in qualifying this year. . .



?
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Larry Lem
human power expert

South Sandwich Islands
2540 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  12:51:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thomas,
Which versions do you plan on bringing to WHPSC 2011? All 3?

Is team Elan separate, and do you know if they are bringing bikes as well (what bikes and for whom)? I know that Hans VV wanted to make a smaller Speedhawk sized for Ellen, but don't know the status.

I see that Delft is making two shells and one bike, so I think that just means one whole vehicle per session at the most.

(I'm wondering how crowded it might be at Battle Mountain this year...)

Larry Lem
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Victor Ragusila
recumbent enthusiast

Canada
402 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  15:34:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
crowded !

We will bring ACE from last year and Vortex, our new bike. Probably 2-3 riders/bike...

Victor
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Larry Lem
human power expert

South Sandwich Islands
2540 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  16:41:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No, no, you're not allowed to bring the same bike unless it went over 80 mph. That's the rules!

Larry Lem
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Alan Krause
recumbent guru

671 Posts

Posted - 04/05/2011 :  22:15:14  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
bring your bikes, run in qualifying, fastest bikes get to run the long course.
20 runs available each day on the long course.
open to all, good luck!

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JMvD
recumbent enthusiast

Netherlands
116 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  02:19:31  Show Profile  Visit JMvD's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Larry Lem

Thomas,
Which versions do you plan on bringing to WHPSC 2011? All 3?


We will bring a trike and a bike, a couple of seats and canopies. Not sure yet what we will manage to complete and who will give it a shot. I'm in for sure!

quote:

I see that Delft is making two shells and one bike, so I think that just means one whole vehicle per session at the most.


Ik guess Delft will bring one complete bike and two riders.

quote:

(I'm wondering how crowded it might be at Battle Mountain this year...)

Larry Lem


I think there will be a lot of clowns

cheers,

Jan-Marcel
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25hz
human power supergeek

Canada
1223 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  05:22:46  Show Profile  Visit 25hz's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Very cool. Thomas, it looks like your leg is actually getting back up to full speed then? About time! Maybe this is top secret and stuff, but with Cygnus and Drop Limits having some of the same members, is Cygnus the BM division of Drop Limits or a separate effort?

I, too, like the performance rating on the riders. Is that subjective/historic or is that what came up from the testing regimens you all went through?
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Upright Mike
human power expert

USA
3864 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  05:37:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

(I'm wondering how crowded it might be at Battle Mountain this year...)Larry Lem

quote:

I think there will be a lot of clowns
cheers, Jan-Marcel

I think the average height of the population of BM will rise by several cm! It all started in about 2008...
Avg height in this photo is greater than 6 foot, 5 inch or 1.95 meters
These guys are taller than most basketball teams! What a site when they come into town!
Team Cygnus and Team Delft may need their own rooms with high ceilings at the Super 8. Gert Jan says he's the smallest of their riders at 6 foot 5.5 inch


Left to Right: Chuck (Orion Trike), Gordon (Varna crew), Warren (Cuda-W), Hans (Cygnus), Thomas (Cygnus)

Edited by - Upright Mike on 04/06/2011 11:21:27
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jnyyz
recumbent enthusiast

Canada
335 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  18:35:09  Show Profile  Visit jnyyz's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi Thomas:

yes I like how you used the schwalbe tire rating graphics. Looking forward to seeing you again at BM.

http://jnyyz.wordpress.com/
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Jeff Wills
human power supergeek

USA
1272 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  21:16:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Upright Mike

quote:

(I'm wondering how crowded it might be at Battle Mountain this year...)Larry Lem

quote:

I think there will be a lot of clowns
cheers, Jan-Marcel

I think the average height of the population of BM will rise by several cm! It all started in about 2008...
Avg height in this photo is greater than 6 foot, 5 inch or 1.95 meters



I gotta get working- at 6-foot-4 I'll fit right in!

__________________
Jeff Wills
All my bikes:
http://home.comcast.net/~jeff_wills/Gallery/index.html
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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 04/07/2011 :  00:57:12  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 25hz

Very cool. Thomas, it looks like your leg is actually getting back up to full speed then? About time! Maybe this is top secret and stuff, but with Cygnus and Drop Limits having some of the same members, is Cygnus the BM division of Drop Limits or a separate effort?

I, too, like the performance rating on the riders. Is that subjective/historic or is that what came up from the testing regimens you all went through?



Hi Tim,

Wellllllll, my ankle is getting better, but will not restore fully;
My ligaments are healed but stretched, so the stability of the ankle is affected (I can hear a popping sound when I pull on my foot...)
The crack in the thalus-bone has healed but still gives me some pain.
The cartalidge is damaged and that means the thalus-bone is grinding against the naviculair-bone, and against the shin-bone. Causing osteofytes (bone-growth).
Without support from an orthopedicshoe I can't walk more than a mile. With it I can walk 3 miles...

For cycling I have been seeing an orthopedic instrumentmaker to develop an orthotic:



This helps, but sofar the pain is still the limiting factor in the equation...

For pictures see: http://community.webshots.com/album/580016712lFrgOW

Team Cygnus is a seperate effort from participants of both Team Elan, and Team Droplimits. So no, not an offspring.

The ratings are subjective/historic for now. We have a recumbent set-up build to have testing of all individuals done by Pieter (see his credentials).

I wrote an update for the website to show more pictures of the design(s). So keep checking the website for updates!

Thomas (6'7").

Edited by - LongJohn on 04/07/2011 01:02:38
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Jaymann
Starting Member

USA
11 Posts

Posted - 04/07/2011 :  10:42:20  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thomas,

Congratulations on the new team, this is so exciting! The website and new design look awesome!
Battle Mountain 2011 will be very exciting with so many new teams and designs.
Can't wait to see the finished products, keep up the good work :)


Jaymann Henry
Team Pak-Lite
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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 04/07/2011 :  11:38:36  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks Jay!

Will you and Barclay be riding enything new?
We are all very exited, the bike is much smaller than the SpeedHawk therefore things look very promising...

Hope to get back after the weekend with updates.

Thomas
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25hz
human power supergeek

Canada
1223 Posts

Posted - 04/08/2011 :  04:51:09  Show Profile  Visit 25hz's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LongJohn

quote:
Originally posted by 25hz

Very cool. Thomas, it looks like your leg is actually getting back up to full speed then? About time! Maybe this is top secret and stuff, but with Cygnus and Drop Limits having some of the same members, is Cygnus the BM division of Drop Limits or a separate effort?

I, too, like the performance rating on the riders. Is that subjective/historic or is that what came up from the testing regimens you all went through?



Hi Tim,

Wellllllll, my ankle is getting better, but will not restore fully;
My ligaments are healed but stretched, so the stability of the ankle is affected (I can hear a popping sound when I pull on my foot...)
The crack in the thalus-bone has healed but still gives me some pain.
The cartalidge is damaged and that means the thalus-bone is grinding against the naviculair-bone, and against the shin-bone. Causing osteofytes (bone-growth).
Without support from an orthopedicshoe I can't walk more than a mile. With it I can walk 3 miles...

For cycling I have been seeing an orthopedic instrumentmaker to develop an orthotic:



This helps, but sofar the pain is still the limiting factor in the equation...

For pictures see: http://community.webshots.com/album/580016712lFrgOW

Team Cygnus is a seperate effort from participants of both Team Elan, and Team Droplimits. So no, not an offspring.

The ratings are subjective/historic for now. We have a recumbent set-up build to have testing of all individuals done by Pieter (see his credentials).

I wrote an update for the website to show more pictures of the design(s). So keep checking the website for updates!

Thomas (6'7").



That's too bad about your ankle. I've trashed both my ankles more times than I can even remember, and while they are both pretty much screwed, the upside is that I don't have the bone-on-bone problem you do. With the amount I ride, and the way I ankle, my ankles are decently stable even though the ligamnets are all torn to shreds, but at least I don't need an ankle brace like yours. Once in a while if I move my left ankle the wrong way, the navicular moves up and locks my ankle from bending forward - which can be fairly painful, but I can eventually massage it back into place. I have laxity in both ankles, so my left ankle allows the foot to slide about 3/4" fore and aft, and the right only about 1/2", but if I pull too hard on the pedal stroke before sufficiently warmed up, I can feel the tibia/fibula joint separating from the talus. Feels a little weird, but it's not really a problem unless they settle back into place in the wrong spot. Most of the time they just ache a lot, but they still feel smooth to operate. Thankfully, I can't imagine what it feels like to have bone on bone like you. I have to be always watchful where and how I walk though, because the least little bit of uneven-ness on the ground, and I could instantly roll and break an ankle again.

I really hope your custom brace ends up working for you. I don't know what the fix would be for getting the bone off the bone. They offered to fuse my ankles for me - I said no thanks. If worse came to worse, you could expand on Warren's idea about pedal systems that actually attach to/go around your calves instead of your feet. I imagine there would be some chafing and circulation issues to overcome though.
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Jaymann
Starting Member

USA
11 Posts

Posted - 04/08/2011 :  13:30:31  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LongJohn

Thanks Jay!

Will you and Barclay be riding enything new?
We are all very exited, the bike is much smaller than the SpeedHawk therefore things look very promising...

Hope to get back after the weekend with updates.

Thomas



Nice, look out 70+ club here comes Thomas!
I will be riding something new, I've been expirementing with a new linear drive system and it looks to be promising.
I took some time off school to spend more time on it and I'm very excited with the possibillies of a super low frontal area bike.
Not sure if Barclay will have a new trike, he will ether make some major modifications to his current trike, or build a new linear one.
I will be looking forward to the updates on your website!

Jaymann Henry
Team Pak-Lite
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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2011 :  05:36:21  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
UPDATE:

Over the easter weekend we made good progress on our first "testfairings".
We are building bombproof, cheap, without honeycomb, fairings first to test and determine hardpoints.
If this works well, we can build our final fairings nice and light.

see: http://cygnus-hpv.nl/Nieuws-ENG.html



Thomas

Edited by - LongJohn on 05/03/2011 12:03:33
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davidw
New Member

Netherlands
62 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2011 :  07:18:56  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I sure hope the fairing will be smaller than this picture... ;-)
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Garrie L Hill
human power supergeek

USA
1806 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2011 :  07:37:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thomas;
So now Arjen can add "Certified High Speed Organic Seat Support" to his resume ;-)



Garrie "carbon based lifeform" Hill
HPRA Co-Dictator of the East
for pics of some of my time and money sucking projects
http://garriehill.winkflash.com/
and
http://s58.photobucket.com/albums/g277/cfbb/
and videos
http://vimeo.com/5513519


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LongJohn
recumbent guru

China
581 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2011 :  12:05:08  Show Profile  Visit LongJohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by davidw

I sure hope the fairing will be smaller than this picture... ;-)



It was a bit big (the picture not the bike )
I corrected it to a smaller size.

Thomas
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Jeff Wills
human power supergeek

USA
1272 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2011 :  20:13:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Garrie L Hill

Thomas;
So now Arjen can add "Certified High Speed Organic Seat Support" to his resume ;-)





If Hans fits inside it, maybe I'll fit, too! Dang... another 'liner?

__________________
Jeff Wills
All my bikes:
http://home.comcast.net/~jeff_wills/Gallery/index.html
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speedshaper
New Member

USA
82 Posts

Posted - 05/07/2011 :  12:32:34  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Beautiful, Thomas, just beautiful.
George
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